The "Nice Guys" archive

Comments - round 36
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Comments - round 33
Comments - round 32
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Comments - round 29
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Comments - round 27
Comments - round 26
Comments - round 25
Comments - round 24
Comments - round 23
Comments - round 22
Comments - round 21
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Comments - round 19
Comments - round 18
Comments - round 17
Comments - round 16
Comments - round 15
Comments - round 14
Comments - round 13
Comments - round 12
Comments - round 11
Comments - round 10
Comments - round 9
Comments - round 8
Comments - round 7
Comments - round 6
Comments - round 5
Comments - round 4
Comments - round 3
Comments - round 2
Comments - round 1.5
Comments - round 1
Nice Guys = BLEAH!
Nice Guys we can do without

'NiceGuy', 'Asshole' - Different Sides of the Same Coin?

by Mithrandir


After reading through your "nice guy" section, I just want to thank you for finally summing up my feelings on the matter more cleverly and eloquently than I could.  In the past, I have had trouble pin-pointing what it was that bothered me about "Nice Guys."  I guess that, at first, I was too busy being confused to become pissed off: whenever a NiceGuy would complain that he has trouble with romance because he's too nice (and being in the middle of a nerdy social circle, I hear these complaints often), my typical thought would be something along the lines of:  "huh; that's weird; every girl who I've dated so far has liked me because I'm nice.  Conversely, none of the girls who have turned me down have done so because of my nicer traits; it's not like they say, "Sorry, but you didn't call me enough nasty names on our first date, and you forgot to slap the waitress' ass!"


Given this, I'd have a hard time believing that being (genuinely) nice is the true cause of this person's lack of romantic success, but I'd figure that perhaps they simply don't have a clue what the real cause is (and some truly don't, I guess).  However, then I read your rants, and it gave me a laugh and also helped me pinpoint another hypocrisy in the NiceGuy philosophy; namely, they see the world as being divided between 3 types of people: nice guys, assholes, and "women."  As if being a "woman" is the only distinctive trait possessed by women, and it is up to the "nice males" and the "asshole males" to compete for this commodity known as "womankind."  How can anyone hold such a mentality and still get confused when nobody sees them as being every woman's dream?


Also, reading the comments that were sent in response to these rants has convinced me that these people aren't just ignorant hypocrites; most of them KNOW that they're really assholes themselves, and are just pissed off that their painstaking tactics are a waste of time. 


Basically, the impression that I got from these comments is that the interests of these NiceGuys are almost identical to those of their "asshole rivals," and that they think of women the same way as well: basically, as potential "rewards" for all their hard work pretending to be a decent person.  Basically, the negative responses were divided between 4 types of people (though you've probably already made these observations):


1)      People who were oblivious to the fact that the rants weren't about genuinely nice people.  It makes me wonder what is going on in a person's head when their initial reaction to a rant such as yours is "why, she must hate nice people!"  I guess that these are the people who stopped reading in the middle of the title.


2)      People who whine that whenever they befriend a girl, she starts going out with some guy who "just wants to get laid," and so then they "can't even get laid!"  They should at least be aware of the irony here, but no; they're not even aware of the hypocrisy.  As you basically said several times, you can tell the difference between a nice person and someone who is only pretending because the faker will complain about how they weren't rewarded for all their "effort." 


Honestly, how can anyone devote so much time and effort into hiding their intentions and feelings towards someone, and then be surprised when these intentions go unfulfilled?  For that matter, how can they think that it's an injustice that their intentions go unfulfilled when they're basically identical to those of the supposedly less-deserving "other guy"?  These are the people who convinced me that NiceGuys know that they are assholes (rather than just being ignorant), and have some nerve claiming not to be.


3)      Some fucked up people spouting weird shit about how women need to be protected/ nurturing/ told what their place is/ (insert patronizing, puritanical gender role here), and how "that damned feminist movement is ruining everything."  These people need a news flash: as we gain more and more knowledge in the fields of psychology, anthropology, and biology, it seems that we find less and less cause to believe that gender roles are anything but socially constructed.  Neither sex is "inherently" anything, and it boggles my mind that people still try and cite some bogus gender role to back up their argument that women are inherently attracted to such-and-such, or that this-and-that are in their nature.  No they're NOT.  Women, like men, are "inherently" in possession of their own fucking brains; it's not like they all run off some computer program, and it's not like they were put here as part of some "divine plan" where step 1 is that they have to be good mothers and obedient wives.


4)      People who think that women must be attracted to assholes because they got dumped once or twice.  Who hasn't?  People like this need to stop seeing each individual as representing the whole of their sex.   When a woman dumps you, this is not a mass rejection by all women.   There is such thing as "individual circumstance," which means that people get together, people break up, and the who/what/why is going to vary.  Maybe it just didn't work out, and it will with another person.   Maybe not.  Maybe her reasons were valid, and it's time for some self-examination.  In any case, a breakup or two doesn't say jack shit about what "women," as a whole, think.


Anyway, I've written too much, and since you've already said it all, it's all the more useless for me to just re-iterate for so many paragraphs.  I just felt like ranting, and figured that I may as well send the rant to the person who inspired it.  Keep writing!




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